by Brandon Gleneicki (AGEOFAQUARIUS) – host of All Of Us, Flames
December 12th, 2025
I’ve been pretty entrenched in internet rap circles for the last couple of years now. Although I generally find them pretty insufferable for a multitude of reasons, I haven’t moved myself away from them because I thoroughly love hip-hop as a genre. Of all the things I find annoying about these spaces, the most confusing thing about them is how temperamental they are about the artists they claim to love. So often, I check the Twitters of Kurrco, or Underground Sound, or whatever other massive rap news pages there are and check out some of the songs they promo from either artists that I enjoy or artists (I will be using artist and rapper here interchangeably, they will ultimately mean the same thing) that I don’t know, and so often I’m confronted with nothing but extremely polarized, short reactions. This is the nature of the internet, I should expect it, but I can’t help but get annoyed any time I see someone comment that an artist is “washed,” or something along those lines.
It feels really trivial on the surface to get annoyed about something like this, but I’ve seen tens of thousands of comments with this premise, and at some point in the last couple years it’s really begun to dig at my skin. I think the most egregious examples I can think of are when artists on the Opium roster (Playboi Carti, Ken Carson, Destroy Lonely, Homixide Gang, and now joined by ApolloRed1) preview 15-second snippets of songs they may or may not even drop, and the comments are flooded with “my GOAT is washed,” “it’s never been more over,” “what happened to him man,” as if one song someone doesn’t immediately click with is indicative of an artist’s career suicide. It’s actually mind-boggling how often I see this sort of sentiment, especially over song snippets. Likely, this is a way for an artist to test the waters with their fans to see what’s clicking and what isn’t, but I can imagine how frustrating it can be for rappers in general artistically when their comments are polluted with only the most polarized reactions to their music.
This sort of discourse is exhausting — well, all music discourse online is. Having been in music-related online spaces since I was 13 or 14, I have a complex understanding of how toxic and fruitless these “debates” can be. Although the game’s changed for most genres since 2015-2016, people don’t fight anymore about how Fishmans is a better band than Car Seat Headrest or vice versa (at least, God, I hope they don’t), the sentiment and tone have stayed the same. Yet, rap is a clear outsider here. I’ve only really seen a rap canon that consists of Kanye West, MF DOOM, and a couple other artists crystallize for my generation in the last couple years. Rock purism dominated what people considered “peak” music for so, so long on the internet. I can remember a time when people thought Neil Young and Van Morrison were impeccable artists, yet artists who made rap music (who are infinitely better than my selected targets) were frozen out of a “classic” distinction, for whatever reason.
More often than not, rappers (especially black ones) are treated as expendable. Writing that feels like such an obvious thing but I don’t think the people that listen to rap even see it that way, to be quite honest. So many people seem like they lose faith in an artist for even the slightest misstep, for even one snippet that they might be lukewarm on. It’s a little maddening. I have a couple examples.
Back in August, Ghais Guevara put out an EP of B-sides and demos, Full Goyard, as a companion piece to his newest mixtape, The Other 2/5ths or: The Absolutely True Diary of a Part-Time Trench Baby, and I saw people saying he was “washed” for releasing it. A B-side EP, indicative of a lack of quality as an artist? That kind of mind would probably belong to the kind of person that would abandon their friend for having an off day.
A soul band with a black frontman like Algiers incorporating rapping into their music on their 2023 album Shook may receive less acclaim than any average Windmill scene band producing “qualityslop” (thank you Joshua Minsoo Kim for my new favorite term) who incorporates rapping into their sound on a whim, also, like Maruja.
When Kid Cudi released the snippet for “FLEX” in late 2023 (a song that was slated to release on his then-upcoming album INSANO), all of Twitter erupted in a cacophonous backlash. Many a tweet claimed that Cudi had completely fallen off as an artist, and despite my often lukewarm-to-negative feelings on him, I would not agree. One misstep as an artist does not equal a grave sin, it makes an artist more human — we are all prone to missteps, artistically or not — and yet that humanity is so often not extended to rappers, especially not black ones. You either have to be Little Simz or billy woods-tier grand with it or you’re going in the Smokepurpp dungeon. I’d also posit it’s easier (and more socially acceptable) now for a white rapper to become the newest 2008-era Kid Cudi (like Lil Peep did) than for a black rapper to (like Lil Tracy).
This sort of hyperbolic attitude toward perceived “failures,” I’d posture, isn’t really something that exists within a vacuum on the internet. Think of the current biggest up-and-coming rappers from the “underground” (I hate this term, it’s really just mainstream-adjacent trap but it’s what’s used colloquially) — it’s Nettspend and fakemink, who notably are rappers who are not black. I recently saw a list on my Twitter feed that these two rappers had been receiving the most traction and plays of any bubbling-up rappers currently, along with other white rappers, like 2hollis, Jane Remover, EsDeeKid and ian. When Nett or fakemink drop music, I see people treating it as an event — it’s all over my timeline for at least a day or two, even if it’s a single. And while there are other black rappers who are comparable in size to them, like OsamaSon, che, LAZER DIM 700, MIKE, Benji Blue Bills, xaviersobased, skaiwater, untiljapan, Glokk40Spaz, prettifun, etc., none of them have the same outward industry connections that the two of them seem to. Nettspend just posted selfies of him with SZA, and fakemink’s been seen hanging out with Playboi Carti, A$AP Rocky, and so many other big names that none of these other rappers seem to be attaining. Even rappers like 2slimey, sniper2004 or Bb trickz, who were initially pushed by underground rap pages as gags seem to be gaining more traction than artists like Tezzus or diamond* or ShawtyRokk or Forever or Fijimacintosh or Unitus or squillo or Navy Blue or quinn or d0llywood1 or Jaeychino or AC640 or SlimeGetEm or Slimesito or Chy Cartier or wildkarduno or Chow Lee or Vontee the Singer or Boofpaxkmooky or Duwap Kaine and so on and so on.
This is because rap is still, subconsciously, seen as an illegitimate genre. The idea of being a “SoundCloud rapper” still has a stigma to it. People see rap as disposable everywhere — so many artists, especially white ones, become rappers and then abandon the genre for others (to various degrees of acceptance by listeners). Post Malone did it. Weiland did it. Tek lintowe did it. All of them got praised for it, so why wouldn’t any other white person choose to start as a rapper and then abandon it once they become vaguely successful enough to afford studiohands, or once they learn how to play guitar (thank god Yeat hasn’t yet). There’s also a stigma around “only listening to rap,” or people who listen to primarily rap in general, but where’s that stigma for rock? Or pop? Just rap? Why? This is, in turn, because rap will never be accepted into a primarily white-focused mainstream. Unlike rock, blues, R&B, house, reggae, jazz, and so many other genres, which have been undeniably co-opted for a contemporary Caucasian audience, there’s something so undeniably “othering” about the ethos of rap, that prevents it from being seen as legitimate. I guess this sort of attitude isn’t new — there’s a reason why the Beastie Boys are international icons, and the Jungle Brothers are seemingly sidelined, or why Prince Paul gets sidelined in greatest producer talks but Alchemist is somehow the frontrunner. But still, I talk to people about music, and they tell me that they haven’t listened to rap since high school, and it makes me feel like I live in some strange alternate reality compared to them. What do you mean you don’t listen to, like, Travis Scott at least?
I see artists like Shallowater and samlrc and Candelabro blow up online, whose only crowning achievement is that they can play crescendos on their guitars, and I see other (white) music nerds throw themselves onto their music unquestioningly. Those same people would shirk at the idea of listening to Sk8star or Harto Falion or NAPPYNAPPA or 12k Gotti or Niontay or MajinBlxxdy or VIP Skylark, who notably lack crescendos but at least aren’t boring. Rappers who are black almost have to happen into cult followings, or success in general, like RXKNephew, Rx Papi, SpaceGhostPurrp or Hi-C, unless they get picked up by Playboi Carti-acolyte blogs who then funnel them up the chain. Even then, those artists who get picked up often get filtered out by the average music fan as “generic trap,” as if their artistic contributions mean nothing in music’s grand scheme as a whole.
Pitchfork recently released an Alphonse Pierre-written review on an album called Out the Blue by WNC WhopBezzy and 70th Street Carlos. The two of them hail from Baton Rouge, Louisiana, and they make a subgenre of rap called jigg, which is not a particularly prolific genre outside of that area. Out the Blue was given the distinction of Best New Music, an honor implying that this is some of the best music the year has to offer, and immediately this review sparked backlash. This honor for an album made by *gasp* street rappers no respectable (read – white) music critic had ever reviewed or heard of before was, to many Pitchfork readers, a deep upset of the social order. They got this and the new Armand Hammer (respectable, serious rap that only real critics and tastemakers enjoy) didn’t? People dismissed it offhand without even bothering to listen to it, and I have a strong reason to believe it was because they viewed the music itself to be below them — it’s just random rappers shoveling their music onto streaming services, why would anyone choose to exalt this? Well, because it’s unique. Listen to the drum programming, the synth brasses, the way the beat cuts in and out, and tell me it’s not outlandish and, for lack of a better word, crazy. It’s not a favorite of mine from this year, I listened to another one of 70th Street Carlos’s solo tapes, Lost Soul, pretty soon after and I liked it more, but I can commend Alphonse for choosing to highlight something most other people wouldn’t have heard otherwise. It’s important to give these sorts of releases a highlight, to help them develop their fanbases, even if they’re not necessarily considered “critically viable,” because, if not music publications and their writers, then who else?
Even the way rap is covered gets a less-than-legitimate feel. At least compared to other more stigmatized genres, like metal and country, rap is covered with the same sort of theatrics that professional sports are covered with. RapTV and RaphouseTV don’t treat the subject of the genre seriously, they curate a sort of fantastical feel to artists they cover and turn them into walking memes. RaphouseTV especially has come under fire for being operated solely by non-black creators to usurp black culture and propagate a sort of caricature of it to a mostly non-black audience. Smaller pages copy this too, like SayCheese (the infamous “SpottemGottem and Pooh Shiesty linked up” tweet comes to mind) and Hyperpop Daily, who was once a good page parodying smaller hyperpop artists but now consistently goes about egotistical rants about their place in rap culture. All the way down the pipeline, people don’t take the artform seriously, it’s spectacle and it’s comedy, and sure the comedy can be entertaining, but it’s indicative of people taking the genre more as a vehicle for social capital than anything.
The worst facet of rap being slighted is leak culture. Sure, some rappers are notorious for gatekeeping their songs, and especially considering their often-massive recorded output, it can sure be frustrating when you only get 18 songs from any rapper every 2-3 years who may have recorded 1800 in that time frame. However, that does not excuse people who hack the hard drives of rappers and leak their art. OsamaSon, Kanye West, Hardrock, Playboi Carti, Lil Uzi Vert, Destroy Lonely, SahBabii and myriads of others have had several thousands of their songs and several of their projects leaked by overly zealous fans who overstep several boundaries of privacy to leak music. I don’t blame their tenacity, I also want to hear more Carti and Uzi songs, but regardless it can seriously hold back any recorded material in an album cycle from being released. Regardless of how the artist may feel about their music being leaked, people continue to breach their supposed favorite artists’ privacy for social capital — the coolest people, and the ones who can get Twitter followers the fastest, are the ones who can drop Carti songs early, after all.
And sure, white rappers may get the same treatment. Nettspend, fakemink, phreshboyswag, DJ Lucas, Lucy, Gods Wisdom, Ayesha Erotica, Bladee, Yung Lean, BBY GOYARD, Sematary, Joey Valence, David Shawty — they’ve all had their controversies, it’s nothing new to claim they’re culture vultures in a non-white space. That rhetoric does not come without reason, and it’s valid reason, but as long as they are respectful to black culture and their black contemporaries there can be reasons to co-opt them. Vanilla Ice, Asher Roth and Brennan Jones were rejected for a reason, turned into mockeries, but Since99 and BabyTron and 1900Rugrat and YL have been able to become equals with their non-white peers. It’s just unfortunate though that non-black rappers are able to express themselves in unconventional or unique ways, but black artists need to achieve a status like Danny Brown, or JPEGMAFIA, or MC Ride (of Death Grips), or Playboi Carti (here he is again) in order to be able to just exist as themselves, exist as someone with alternative sensibilities. bleood can make weird trap and be considered a “TikTok artist” (in a derivative sense) but Marlon DuBois can do the same thing and no one bats an eye. Brazilian funk MCs like MC GW or MC Denadai get on the most abstract beats known to man and it goes viral as a TikTok sound but god forbid Kendrick Lamar gets on a weird beat that blends nervous music with dancehall and grime like he did for the title track of his most recent record, GNX. Yabujin is considered an icon but Luci4/Axxturel/4jay has been all-but-forgotten for other non-black artists in a genre he created. And don’t think this is me dismissing any of these non-black artists I’m comparing to black artists, they’re all great in their own right, I just want to compare public perceptions here.
I wanna use this space that I have here to highlight some talent that may not be getting any traction. Dark trap as a genre was what inspired me to make music in the first place, so BMB Deathrow and Reptilian Club Boyz will always have a soft spot in my heart. 1of1soldier is a great rapper — his DMV drill song “Yaas” has been on heavy replay throughout this entire year for me and it’s a shame he hasn’t been a more prominent figure in the trap side of the underground. Bear1boss is ridiculously underrated, easily one of my favorite rappers, a ridiculously potent songwriter who intricately understands how to blend vocal melody into sugary beats. AyooLii had to grow on me a bit, but lowend is such a fun genre that needs more attention on it. The whole diary scene in general — wokeups, jovan, kynlary — all produce some ridiculously hooky and fun PluggnB variants that can just be so addicting in the right mood. 454, Adamn Killa, They Hate Change, Swapa, AKAI SOLO, Polo Perks, Jawnino, Myaap, Tisakorean, Bree Runway, ELUCID, 26ar, thr33, Benjicold, RAFA, 509 BMG, ATL Smook, DJ Ess, slaywitme, lade, YT, Len, yrsci, Smokingskul, 1oneam, Zodiak (may he rest in peace), Jim Legxacy, xang, 5G, Nolanberollin, Zelly ocho, 38Kea, Jalen Elk Star/Big Up Menace X, Pretty V, BFB Da Packman, Talibando, DaeMoney, Sauce Walka, Voochie P, 10kdunkin, El Cousteau, kels!, Nosaint, Earl From Yonder, Guapo, Zukenee, SINN6R, kwes e, N4T, MfanaTouchLine, Bruiser Wolf, Zelooperz, ST6 JodyBoof, Tony Shhnow, Ecko Bazz, Yung Kayo, Heymylan, VampViolence, SiyahXO!, Baby Kia, Balaa MC, Dälek, Onoe Caponoe, Stove God Cooks, Pink Siifu, Tha God Fahim, o0o and so on and so forth. I feel like I could never highlight enough artists, like I would literally be here forever just listing every artist whose music I enjoy listening to. And each one of them deserves to be appreciated, because their artistry brings something new to the table.
Despite how much presence rap has had on the mainstream in the last 15 years, we still have a long way to go with our cultural reception towards it. Eminem is more critically and publicly acclaimed than the Ying Yang Twins, or Baby D, or Pastor Troy, and that’s a pretty big problem. We can only work to rehabilitate the image of all these rappers and producers that have laid the groundwork for our current forms of music so much, and we have a long way to go, but my hope is that one day black rappers will no longer be seen as disposable.
